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(14) Waiting for Hallowee...
Forum: Brexit from UK and EU27 perspective
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Irish backstop questions
Forum: Brexit from UK and EU27 perspective
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  Irish backstop questions
Posted by: TheWriggler - 18-09-19, 01:09 PM - Forum: Brexit from UK and EU27 perspective - Replies (30)

This has probably been covered in previous threads, but I couldn't find one dedicated to this subject. I'm puzzled by these questions.

"The European Union's chief Brexit negotiator said that the bloc would protect its citizens, businesses and peace in Ireland "in all circumstances"." (RTE.ie) - what in practice does this mean?

If no deal is reached by 31 October (and there is no 3rd extension) what will actually happen?
There are something like 275 crossing points. Would some of these be closed off physically? Would there be customs checks on the others? Who would insist on this and would would the reasons be? Would that actually be possible? It seems quite likely that any such infrastructure would be demolished by those living nearby.

Does No Deal necessarily mean a breach of the GFA?
Would it actually be a breach of the GFA to set up border posts like this? It is obviously against the spirit of the GFA, but having read it it doesn't seem to say much about the border at all.  There's a discussion about it here.

Is there an irony about insisting on the Backstop so strongly that the very thing it is designed to prevent comes about because of this insistence?
The Backstop is, as I understand it, to protect both the GFA and the Single Market. I don't know how the Customs Union relates to this.  I believe that "protecting the GFA" means essentially ensuring that the borders stay open. But a No Deal departure means that they won't, doesn't it? (see above).

In asking this question I'm not trying to attribute blame to the EU27 in any way. Clearly the UK is solely responsible for this mess.

I just don't understand why it wouldn't be better to drop the Backstop in the hope that a solution of some kind can be reached in the future: so under the WA the UK would stay aligned with the EU while negotiations on a future FTA were happening. If those failed then the question of whether NI would stay in the CU and SM could be addressed at that point.  If the UK refused to do that, then, and only then at that point in the future, the question of a hard border would have to be addressed.

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  wto trade ruling on us, eu tariffs
Posted by: Ranter. - 16-09-19, 10:01 AM - Forum: EU Politics - No Replies


this will just spur europe on to further protecting its own markets, and developing new workarounds to us mechanisms

read about a new replacement gps system called galileo, which the uk just got frozen out of the other day (lol.

in the next fifty years,the euro is expected to become the default reserve currency.just reading a bit about how european central banks are already switching.

mark carney touted a new set of central bank cryptocurrencies,with other european natiobs,to help unseat the dollar and provide extra flexibility

you can now use this as an excuse to extricate yourselves from any reliance on the usa,and improve quality & standards in many things you import

footnote, i say you and not we bcause we were ,„promiised „ brecksit means broxit according to the incredible hulk, or the incredible bellend as i call him, and we re out by the 31st of october, 2090 sorry 19

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  One language, one nation
Posted by: Barbarossa - 10-09-19, 06:35 AM - Forum: EU Politics - Replies (10)

One language for full integration.
English is a nice compromise. 
It’s worked so well in Ireland.
Anybody who disagrees is anti-European.

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  Life and politics in Brussels or elsewhere EU-wise
Posted by: CaseyJones1900UK2019 - 05-09-19, 11:17 PM - Forum: EU Politics - Replies (5)

Write about your personal experience in connection with the EU, be it in Brussels or elsewhere in the EU-countries, including traveling adventures and curiosities and such, and / or post interesting links from others on it.

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  Okhrana subversive's corner
Posted by: okhrana subversive - 26-07-19, 06:00 PM - Forum: UK Politics - Replies (65)

Okhrana subversive's corner

I have my suspicions that David Cameron was secretly a Brexiteer all along.

One of his aides appearing on newsnight said: ""I did tell him I believed in Brexit... I argued, and so did he, he also believed in leaving the European Union before he came Prime Minister" Steve Hilton claims David Cameron believed in Brexit before he became PM."

That he deliberately mis-ran the Tory referendum campaign in order to get Brexit passed.

When you compare the slick profesdionalism and money spent on the 2014 Scot indyref, the 2011 AV ref to the IN campaign (which was absolutely abysmal) as masterminded by senior Tories you do have to wonder if the whole thing wasnt deliberately planned and contrived from the beginning.

Brexit has been on the agenda since 1975; and even in 1997 we had the so called Referendum Party running on the ticket of Brexit. And then you've got Bojo himself who used to be a Brexit Brussels correspondent all the way back in the 1980's.

He knows Brexit is a disaster as proven by his unpublished article comparing the benefits of Brexit and remain.

All they needed was a bit of pushing, a bit of support and some backhanders from Russian oligarcs and bob's your uncle

[Image: attachment.php?aid=20] Ajda

This thread was started by okhrana subversive with the above opening post. The original title of the thread was Contrived from the start: a Brexit conspiracy theory. The debate on this thread then went into different directions, so I changed the title to Okhrana subversive's corner - also to provide okhrana with some space for posting comments without having to stick to the thread topic or finding appropriate threads for his/her comments.

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  (14) Waiting for Halloween with PM Johnson (after 24 July 2019)
Posted by: Ajda Slovenia - 25-07-19, 12:00 AM - Forum: Brexit from UK and EU27 perspective - Replies (474)

(14) Waiting for Halloween with PM Johnson (after 24 July 2019)

So PM May is out, and PM Johnson moved to Downing Street 10 on 24 July 2019. The Brexit monster has chewed up already the second PM.

Johnson has 99 days until B3-day:

[Image: attachment.php?aid=235]
Image URL (larger version): http://debateuncensored.co.uk/attachment.php?aid=235

So we are now waiting for no-IFs-no-BUTs Brexit on 31 October 2019.

The Brexit clock on 24 June 2019:

  • 2,373 days since Cameron announced the Brexit referendum (the Bloomberg speech, 23 Jan 2013)
  • 1,539 days since the British voters voted for a Tory government which promised a Brexit referendum (7 May 2015)
  • 1,506 days since MPs voted with a large majority for the referendum bill = approval of the referendum (544 to 53 on 9 June 2015)
  • 1126 days since the referendum (23 June 2016)
  • 903 days since the MPs voted with a large majority to trigger Article 50 = approval of exit (494 to 122 on 1 Feb 2017)
  • 847 days since the UK triggered Article 50 = start of the legal procedure for exit (29 March 2017)
  • 776 days since the British voters voted with a large majority for the parties supporting Brexit with exit from the customs union and the single market (8 June 2017)
  • 765 days since the start of negotiations (19 June 2017)
  • 593 days since the UK signed the Joint Report including the Irish backstop (8 December 2017)
  • 241 days since endorsement of the WA at the special EU summit (25 November 2018)
  • 190 days since the 1st meaningless vote in HoC about the WA (15 Jan 2018)
  • 134 days since the 2nd meaningless vote in HoC (12 Mar 2019)
  • 124 days since approval of extension (22 Mar 2019)
  • 117 days since no-Brexit day (B1-day) and the 3rd meaningless vote (29 March 2019)
  • 105 days since approval of extension to extension (10 April 2019)
  • 103 days since B2-day (12 April 2019)
  • 59 days since EU elections (26 May 2019)
  • 47 days since PM May's resignation as Tory leader (7 Jun 2019)
  • today (24 Jun 2019): Johnson becomes PM
  • 22 days since the first session of the new European Parliament (2 July 2019)
  • 85 days to the October meeting of the European Council (17-18 Oct 2019)
  • 99 days to B3-day and new European Commission (31 Oct 2019)
Tick, tock ... 

"I hear no whistling, just the clock ticking." (Barnier on 12 July 2017 = 742 days ago)

"Please do not waste this time." (Tusk on 10 April 2019 = 105 days ago)

On this thread

Key Brexit documents: The Withdrawal Agreement and extensions

Brexit preparedness

Brexit documentaries

Other Brexit info

How long does it take to call early elections?

Procedure for recalling the House of Commons from recess

This thread continues the debate from the previous thread (which is now closed):

(13) The battle for Number 10 (after 7 June 2019)

In case you missed something or want to binge-read, you can find all previous seasons here (see the numbered threads):

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  (3) The road to VDL's Commission (from 19 July 2019)
Posted by: Ajda Slovenia - 19-07-19, 09:06 AM - Forum: EU Politics - Replies (21)

(3) The road to VDL's Commission (from 19 July 2019)

Ursula von der Leyen is since 16 July 2019 the European Commission president-elect, so time to open a new chapter (thread).

Now we are moving into the minefield of assembling the whole Commission team. What could possibly go wrong here...  Big Grin   

This thread is also about following other important developments in our EU (even during summer holidays) - so post here about EU news other than the top-jobs too.

For general debates about the future of our EU and general EU issues, check other threads in the EU Politics forum into which your comment may fit - here is the list of threads:

Help Uschi find some more women!  Big Grin   

Nominated Commission candidates

F ... Germany: Ursula von der Leyen (EPP)
M ... Netherlands: Frans Timmermans (S&D), vice-president
F ... Denmark: Margrethe Vestager (RE), vice-president
M ... Spain: Josep Borrell (S&D), representative for foreign affairs
M ... Austria: Johannes Hahn (EPP)
x ... Belgium: 
F ... Bulgaria: Mariya Gabriel (EPP)
x ... Croatia: 
F ... Cyprus: Stella Kyriakides (EPP)
F ... Czechia: Věra Jourová (RE)
F ... Estonia: Kadri Simson (RE)
F ... Finland: Jutta Urpilainen (S&D)
x ... France: 
M ... Greece: Margaritis Schinas (EPP)
M ... Hungary: László Trócsányi (EPP)
M ... Ireland: Phil Hogan (EPP)
x ... Italy: 
M ... Latvia: Valdis Dombrovskis (EPP)
x ... Lithuania: 
M ... Luxembourg: Nicolas Schmit (S&D)
F ... Malta: Helena Dalli (S&D)
M ... Poland: Krzysztof Szczerski (ECR)
x ... Portugal: 
x ... Romania: 
M ... Slovakia: Maroš Šefčovič (S&D)
M ... Slovenia: Janez Lenarčič (unaffiliated; will cooperate with RE as a Commissioner)
x ... Sweden: 
x ... United Kingdom: 

19 total nominated

Gender score:
11 male
8 female

Party score:
6 S&D
4 RE

This thread continues the debate from the previous thread (which is now closed):

(2) Nomination and election of new EU leaders (from 28 May 2019)

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  Debunking the UK Boulevard Press
Posted by: Real European - 05-07-19, 12:24 AM - Forum: Brexit from UK and EU27 perspective - Replies (4)

Debunking the UK Boulevard Press

For those reading the Boulevard press,  it may be useful to have some background information to handle the experience. It's a journey into a parallel universe.

I installed the NewsGuard extension in Firefox.

About DE it says "This website generally maintains basic standards of credibilty and transparency, with some significant exceptions".

the "significant exceptions are:

  • a red flag for the criterion "avoids deceptive headlines"
  • a red flag for the citerion "gathers and presents information responsibly"
So you are warned. In my experience, the click bait titles often are very misleading and contain all kinds of claims that at times are the opposite of what is writtin in the article itself. Many users do not read the article, hence end up having a very perverted idea of reality. The deception in the articles ranges from omitting the vital and essential l information to dowright lies (like stating that Merkel said something while Merkel said the exact opposite).

Keeping that in mind, I will, on occasion, post some background information with articles ran by DE, not just about their disinformation, but also issues of general interest, to debunk the stories in the UK press.

Please add your own background information that can be helpful to debunk news "stories".

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  After Brexit
Posted by: Blackbeard's Ghost - 21-06-19, 11:15 AM - Forum: Brexit from UK and EU27 perspective - Replies (24)

After Brexit

Will it be Johnson or will it be Hunt? Frankly I don't care. Both have a reputation for being a little bit detached from the truth. 
In my opinion the UK is heading for a "no deal" at the end of October simply because there are not enough British politicians with the good sense and the courage to stop it. I also believe that "no deal" will be extremely damaging economically to both the EU and to the UK but that the UK will bear the brunt of this. I do not forget either that damage will be caused is so many other areas apart from economics. My question - and the purpose of this thread - is how will all this affect attitudes in Europe and within the UK?

In Europe: many EU citizens are already exasperated by the UK's actions. Will this be translated into anger and hostility when people start losing jobs as a result of Brexit? Will Europeans come to see Brexit as a hostile act?

In the UK: My guess is that Brexiters will very briefly celebrate their independence only to be confronted in very short order with severe economic disruption. Will they (1) admit that they made a mistake? (2) blame the EUSSR? (3) blame remainers for sabotaging their beautiful project? My guess is (2) and (3).
How will people react when, having fought so long for something they finally get and then realise that almost everything they just dismissed as "project fear" is project reality. It will really be like smashing their heads into a brick wall but will they blame their heads or the wall.
Remainers are going to be mightily angry. Will they (1) try to make a success of Brexit or (2) lash out at Brexiters. My guess is (2)
A UK friend recently told me that "we need to find a way to bring the country back together" but despaired of a solution. Personally I don't see anyway the UK will avoid entrenched division;

What are your thoughts?

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  No Deal Readiness
Posted by: Real European - 12-06-19, 05:01 PM - Forum: Brexit from UK and EU27 perspective - Replies (4)

No Deal Readiness

Considering the increasing likelihood of a no deal Brexit, here is today's communication form the EU commission in full :

Eureopan Commission Wrote:European Commission - Press release
‘No-deal' Brexit: European Commission takes stock of preparations ahead of the June European Council (Article 50)
Brussels, 12 June 2019

Ahead of the June European Council (Article 50), the European Commission has today taken stock – in its fifth Brexit Preparedness Communication – of the European Union's Brexit preparedness and contingency measures, particularly in light of the decision taken on 11 April by the European Council (Article 50), at the request of and in agreement with the United Kingdom, to extend the Article 50 period to 31 October 2019. 

In light of the continued uncertainty in the United Kingdom regarding the ratification of the Withdrawal Agreement – as agreed with the UK government in November 2018 – and the overall domestic political situation, a ‘no-deal' scenario on 1 November 2019 very much remains a possible, although undesirable, outcome.

Since December 2017, the European Commission has been preparing for a ‘no-deal' scenario. To date, the Commission has tabled 19 legislative proposals, 18 of which have been adopted by the European Parliament and Council. Political agreement has been reached on the remaining proposal – the contingency Regulation on the EU budget for 2019 –, which is expected to be formally adopted later this month. The Commission has also adopted 63 non-legislative acts and published 93 preparedness notices. In light of the extension of the Article 50 period, the Commission has screened all these measures to ensure that they continue to meet their intended objectives. The Commission has concluded that there is no need to amend any measures on substance and that they remain fit for purpose. The Commission does not plan any new measures ahead of the new withdrawal date.

The Commission recalls that it is the responsibility of all stakeholders to prepare for all scenarios. Given that a ‘no-deal' scenario remains a possible outcome, the Commission strongly encourages all stakeholders to take advantage of the extra time provided by the extension to ensure that they have taken all necessary measures to prepare for the UK's withdrawal from the EU. Today's Communication provides details on the extensive preparations in the EU27 in areas such as citizens' residence and social security entitlements, customs and taxation, transport, fishing, financial services as well as medicinal products, medical devices and chemical substances.

A ‘no-deal' scenario

In a ‘no-deal' scenario, the UK will become a third country without any transitional arrangements. All EU primary and secondary law will cease to apply to the UK from that moment onwards. There will be no transition period, as provided for in the Withdrawal Agreement. This will obviously cause significant disruption for citizens and businesses and would have a serious negative economic impact, which would be proportionally much greater in the United Kingdom than in the EU27 Member States.

As outlined by President Juncker in the European Parliament on 3 April 2019, should a ‘no-deal' scenario occur, the UK would be expected to address three main separation issues as a precondition before the EU would consider embarking on discussions about the future relationship. These are: (1) protecting and upholding the rights of citizens who have used their right to free movement before Brexit, (2) honouring the financial obligations the UK has made as a Member State and (3) preserving the letter and spirit of the Good Friday Agreement and peace on the island of Ireland, as well as the integrity of the internal market.

The EU's ‘no-deal' preparedness and contingency work: continued vigilance in selected areas

Preparing for the UK's withdrawal is a joint effort by public administrations and economic operators. The Commission has held extensive technical discussions with the EU27 Member States both on general issues of preparedness and contingency work and on specific sectorial, legal and administrative preparedness issues. The Commission has also completed a tour of the capitals of the 27 EU Member States. The visits showed a high degree of preparation by Member States for all scenarios.

Today's Communication focuses on areas in which continued and particular vigilance is needed in the coming months:

Citizens' residence and social security entitlements
  • Member States had prepared or adopted national contingency measures before 12 April 2019 to ensure that UK nationals and their non-EU family members could remain legally resident in the immediate period after a ‘no-deal' withdrawal.
  • To provide further clarity, the Commission has provided an overview of residency rights in the EU27 Member States (see here, including direct links to national preparedness websites). This will continue to be updated.
Medicinal products, medical devices and chemical substances
  • Only a small number of centrally authorised medical products (around 1%) had not been brought into regulatory conformity by 12 April 2019 The European Medicines Agency (EMA) is now close to completing the regulatory compliance process for products that are authorised centrally.
  • For products that are authorised at national level, more work remains to be done to bring remaining medicinal products into regulatory compliance by 31 October 2019.
  • The transfer of certificates for medical devices from UK notified bodies to EU27 notified bodies is ongoing.
  • As regards chemical substances, by the end of April 2019, REACH registrations of 463 substances had been transferred to the EU27 Member States, while 718 still remained registered only by registrants established in the United Kingdom. The European Chemicals Agency (ECHA) opened a ‘Brexit window' in REACH-IT to take the necessary steps to transfer their REACH registrations ahead of the withdrawal date.
Customs, indirect taxation and border inspection posts
  • In the field of customs and indirect taxation, the Commission organised numerous technical meetings, and published guidance notes on customs, value-added tax (VAT) and excise ahead of the previous withdrawal date.
  • National administrations have made significant investments in infrastructure and human resources, primarily in Member States that are the main entry and exit points for the EU's trade with the United Kingdom. Member States are also working with the Commission in its training and communication efforts to reach out to economic operators and stakeholders in general.
  • In the field of sanitary and phytosanitary controls (SPS), EU27 Member States have set up new Border Inspection Posts (BIPs) or extending existing ones at entry points of imports from the United Kingdom into the EU.
  • The contingency Regulation on air transport includes a specific mechanism for EU airlines to comply with the EU majority ownership and control requirements. This process is underway and the Commission is in regular contact with national authorities.
  • In the rail transport sector, operators that have not taken the necessary steps to obtain the relevant EU27 documents should do the necessary to obtain them.
Fishing activities
  • In the fisheries sector, the Commission has taken swift action to implement the EU contingency Regulations. The Commission and Member States have worked together to collect information in the appropriate format so that authorisation requests by EU vessels to access UK waters can be handled as soon as the contingency Regulation on fishing authorisations becomes applicable.
  • The Commission has also worked closely with Member States to adapt their Operational Programmes so that resources under the European Maritime and Fisheries Fund can be used for temporary cessation, if needed and appropriate.
Financial services
  • While in the run-up to 12 April 2019, firms had made significant progress with their contingency planning, some residual issues remain. Insurance firms, payment services providers and other financial service operators which remain unprepared regarding certain aspects of their business (for example contract management and access to infrastructures) are strongly encouraged to finalise their preparatory measures by 31 October 2019. The Commission is working with EU level and national supervisors to ensure that firms' contingency plans are fully implemented, and it expects that UK supervisors will not prevent firms from implementing such plans.

For more information: what should I do in a ‘no-deal' scenario?

To know more about how to prepare for a ‘no-deal' scenario, EU citizens can contact Europe Direct for any questions. Call Freephone 00 800 6 7 8 9 10 11 from anywhere in the EU, in any official EU language. 

Further useful links:

EU citizens
-      Today's Communication
-      European Commission preparedness website
-      Overview of residence rights in each EU27 Member States
-      Member States national ‘no-deal' websites
-      Notice on Travelling
-      Factsheets on travelling, citizens' rights, studying, and consumer rights
-      Q&A on Erasmus
-      Q&A on a ‘no-deal' scenario
-      Information for EU citizens living in the UK
EU businesses
-      A range of materials on customs and indirect taxation (including a simple 5-step checklist) for businesses
-      Information related to Agriculture
-      Seven Things Businesses in the EU27 need to know in order to prepare for Brexit

Source: http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-19-2951_en.htm

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